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  #16  
Old 11-07-2018, 08:06
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I still say its their second best album after The Holy Bible.
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  #17  
Old 11-07-2018, 08:34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raven View Post
Serious? Ha. Your truth?
And aye throwing around the fascism word.....reckon Corbyn's inspired by Mussolini then?? And has a 5 year plan if he becomes Uncle Jezza? Hmmmn
I'm not saying that, I quite like Corbyn. I'm just saying from certain point of view, some of his policies could be construed as Fascist.

I have no truth, I believe in nothing.
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  #18  
Old 11-07-2018, 10:57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suicide Aldi View Post
What would you say was hid highest point as a lyricist then?
EMG and Lifeblood.

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Originally Posted by Phil C View Post
Actually, as I remember it, the public liked the album a lot more than the critics - Melody Maker and NME only rated it around 25 in the albums of the year, but IIRC it was voted the album of the year in one of them by the readership. Off the back of it they played the 60,000 fan Manic Millennium and then hit number 1 with a punk single. KYE charted at 2, and Lifeblood at 13 - why would people not be buying Lifeblood because of an album they'd made 6 years before?

You don't like the album - that's fine, but the idea that it's a poor album is your opinion, not objective fact. Blaming it for the failure of an album that came after the abrasive punk album that was actually designed to lose them casual fans is just wrong.

Oh, and I think there are some lovely lyrics on it as well.
I see where you're coming from but still see that as a result of EMG success. I know a few people who went to the Millennium gig. They weren't even Manics fans though, but it was a big event, everyone in Wales wanted to be there (I lived there at the time) and the Manics were down for the gig based on the success of EMG that led into Truth.

The way I look at it is that ADFL was a stronger single than Tolerate but Tolerate got to No.1, just not off its own back - unlike ADFL - instead off their popularity. Had they released Why So Sad or Found That Soul at that time, they would have reached No.1 also, but by then their popularity had waned, because of Truth.

I think we all know it as objective fact that ADFL was their big hit in terms of popularity. Not because it is written as fact anywhere but because we just all know it.

Not knocking anyone who loves the album but it's surely clear they shed loads of fans with it.
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  #19  
Old 12-07-2018, 06:54
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Am I only who listens to Tolerate and wonders the hell it got to number 1? It doesn't feel like it has has hit single written all over it.
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  #20  
Old 12-07-2018, 17:12
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If they were losing fans after the truth album how did masses get to number 1? It was KYE that lost them fans not Truth.
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  #21  
Old 12-07-2018, 19:13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hummingbird View Post
If they were losing fans after the truth album how did masses get to number 1? It was KYE that lost them fans not Truth.
KYE put me on a Manics hiatus for years, totally agree with you.
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  #22  
Old 12-07-2018, 19:30
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Originally Posted by Routine Builder View Post
Am I only who listens to Tolerate and wonders the hell it got to number 1? It doesn't feel like it has has hit single written all over it.
It's possibly my favourite song of all time. Not favourite Manics song, favourite song, full stop.
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  #23  
Old 12-07-2018, 19:32
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Originally Posted by Glass Angel View Post
KYE put me on a Manics hiatus for years, totally agree with you.
I love them both, although I prefer KYE personally.
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  #24  
Old 12-07-2018, 22:35
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I'd go further back than that and say ADFL. When Cameron came into power in 2010 and immediately started saying that libraries should close because we couldn't afford them and had ministers proposing paying benefits via a card that couldn't be used to buy tobacco or alcohol, because the poor were only poor because of bad lifestyle choices, when the whole austerity thing kicked in, for some, not them, though we were all in it together somehow, that single should have been rereleased back then. Regarding Truth, I always see it as the sister album to THB, Richey screaming this is how it is and I can't cope on the first and Nicky sighing this is how it is and you just have to find a way to deal with it on the other.
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  #25  
Old 13-07-2018, 13:16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hummingbird View Post
If they were losing fans after the truth album how did masses get to number 1? It was KYE that lost them fans not Truth.
The lead singles from KYE and LB did nothing to help how people perceived them after their late 90s output. Those singles and the albums (mainly KYE) certainly divided a lot of people who got into them from EMG / TIMT. I always remember the first time that Nixon was played on the Jo Whiley show. It was on Radio 1 in 2004 and someone sent in a message saying that it sounded like something by the Pet Shop Boys haha. I must admit, I didn't know what to think the first time I heard SWSS. It still baffles me to this day!
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  #26  
Old 13-07-2018, 20:44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hummingbird View Post
If they were losing fans after the truth album how did masses get to number 1? It was KYE that lost them fans not Truth.
Be Here Now got to No.1, sold like hotcakes. Masses was the final hanging on to the EMG popularity.

Found That Soul is a much better song but no more No.1s once the dust had settled on the Truth. Even though KYE hadn't yet come out when those 2 singles were in the charts. Had Truth been really popular KYE and its first singles would have sold Be Here Now style, even if it wasn't what people wanted in retrospect.

Of course the critics don't figure things out in retrospect either, so KYE still got relatively kind reviews. Later on they figured out the error of judgement and that the fans had already moved on, and so they reserved their venom for Lifeblood.

And anything that comes after that story has been told is purely incidental.
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